Some advice please

[Overthehill]

I'm not new to bow hunting but have only targeted whitetails. We're considering moving up to moose or elk for next season and wonder what adjustments we might need to make with our equipment before considering tackling the big boys. (eg. arrow weight, broadhead style, draw weight.....) I've seen moose still standing after taking 3 338's in the boiler room so am somewhat concerned about the kill power of a single arrow.

[Kirby]

Well, first, what are the stats on your gear now? draw weight? b-heads? etc. Second, a single arrow is absolutly deadly. You put the arrow in the right place, and it will go down, and fast.

Kirby

[brotherjack]

Originally Posted by Overthehill

I'm not new to bow hunting but have only targeted whitetails. We're considering moving up to moose or elk for next season and wonder what adjustments we might need to make with our equipment before considering tackling the big boys. (eg. arrow weight, broadhead style, draw weight.....) I've seen moose still standing after taking 3 338's in the boiler room so am somewhat concerned about the kill power of a single arrow.

Fair warning - all I bowhunt is deer (and I use a crossbow at that), so a lot of this is just stuff I've read, not my experience talking. That said, I read a lot, so here's my thoughts on it.

Well, for bigger critters, you want some decent foot-pounds of force when the arrow hits. A bare minimum of 45lbs or so of KE (kenetic energy) is what I've seen recommended for critters that size, and most recommend something in the 60+lbs of KE range. (KE meaning how much force the arrow hits the target with, not how many pounds of pull your bow has!). If you're not already shooting an arrow with that much KE, you can add foot/lbs by either upping the velocity of any given arrow, or by raising the weight of the arrow (or both). Raising the weight of the arrow, of course, makes your trajectories more rainbow-like, so I would rather have a little faster than a little heavier for my own self - but that's me. If you're shooting a 60lb-ish compound bow, you're probably already in the right neighbourhood anyway - but so many factors can affect velocity/KE that check the spec's on your bow/setup to be sure.

Also, you want a broadhead that penetrates very well in case you center-punch a rib bone. Any of the better cut-on-contact broadheads should do pretty good at this (razorcaps, montecs, etc). Something like a Muzzy wouldn't be bad either if you don't like the cut-on-contact's. And speaking of heads - virtually all of the open-on-impact heads will spend a lot of the KE of your arrow opening the blades and pushing the much wider cutting surfaces through your critter - not at all what you want on moose/elk size critters.

And, pick your shots much more carefully. That (near)-perfect broadside shot is pretty much the only really reliable 'dead in 50 yards or less' shot you can take on a big critter. Even quartering away isn't the easy-money shot it is on deer because of the size (and possible contents) of the stomach you have to put an arrow through to reach the vitals. Lots of really big critters have been taken with shots other than perfect broadside mind you, but the point I'm getting at is that it's very rare that a critter nailed with a perfect broadside shot ever wound up as wounded/unrecoverable. The first deer I ever shot with an arrow was a wounded/unrecoverable, and trust me, you don't want that feeling.

Anyway, others may have more or better things to say, but that's my advice to you.

[Kirby]

Originally Posted by brotherjack

Also, you want a broadhead that penetrates very well in case you center-punch a rib bone. Any of the better cut-on-contact broadheads should do pretty good at this (razorcaps, montecs, etc). Something like a Muzzy wouldn't be bad either if you don't like the cut-on-contact's. And speaking of heads - virtually all of the open-on-impact heads will spend a lot of the KE of your arrow opening the blades and pushing the much wider cutting surfaces through your critter - not at all what you want on moose/elk size critters.

Agreeing with, but also disagreeing, some of the new mech heads take very little energy to open up, depends on the model, the Spit-fires, take alot, tekans don't(but they are illegal in some provices.) As for cut on contacts, some are crap, just like any other head. Stick with high quality heads, Muzzy, Thunderheads, Montecs, Rocky mountains, and you should do fine, you go cheap on broadheads, and your gonna regret it later.

Originally Posted by brotherjack

And, pick your shots much more carefully. That (near)-perfect broadside shot is pretty much the only really reliable 'dead in 50 yards or less' shot you can take on a big critter. Even quartering away isn't the easy-money shot it is on deer because of the size (and possible contents) of the stomach you have to put an arrow through to reach the vitals.

You should not have to put an arrow through stomach on a quartering away shot. If the animal is more than 30-35 degrees facing away, you start risking having to put it into the stomach to get the lungs, but then you are shooting such a steep angle you have a high chance of just taking out the one lung. Quartering shots, you should be aiming 5" back of a broadside shot, you'll double lung it, however, you risk hitting the offside sholder, and not getting a pass through shot, and therefore less blood trail.

Kirby

[Rocket]

If your shooting a compound 50#'s at your draw length it is lots of so called power. I shoot a 57# longbow and on October 1st at 1430hrs my moose was shot at 19m and ran 50m and went down. The arrow penetrated up to the nock after breaking a rib. You should not have to go bigger, faster etc to hunt Elk or Moose if your equipment is reasonable. Proper bow tunning and arrow flight are more important.

I use a cut on contact broadhead therefor I still get good penetration out of a traditional bow. I use magnus and razorcap broadheads. I have used other styles like the thunder heads but they require more energy to get the same penetration. Try to get your arrow weight, ready to shoot, over 550grains. Mine are close to the 600grain mark. I believe in the arrow weight theory rather than speed.

All the tech spec things aside practice is still the most important thing. I try to shoot a couple times a week all year. A couple months before the season I try to shoot everyday. Even if it is only a couple of arrows. Then you have to be realistic and honest with yourself. Don't plan on shooting beyond your most accurate range and don't shoot at anything other than a broadside or "slightly" quartering away shot.

The person makes the shot not the gear.

Good luck on the moose and elk, they are a rush at 20m.

[brotherjack]

Originally Posted by Kirby

Agreeing with, but also disagreeing, some of the new mech heads take very little energy to open up, depends on the model, the Spit-fires, take alot, tekans don't(but they are illegal in some provices.) As for cut on contacts, some are crap, just like any other head. Stick with high quality heads, Muzzy, Thunderheads, Montecs, Rocky mountains, and you should do fine, you go cheap on broadheads, and your gonna regret it later.

Yeah, the G5 Tekan, and the Rocky Mtn Snyper are the two I'm aware of that open in such a way as to not spend a lot of KE opening. Possibly others out there too - I for sure don't know everything. But virtually all of the other ones I've ever seen are variations of the same fold-back design with big monster length blades which mostly swing back to very flat angles, which are the ones I'm referring to.

And yeah, total agreement with you on sticking with good heads - whatever your choice of head style. Wal-Mart is not an archery store.

Originally Posted by Kirby

You should not have to put an arrow through stomach on a quartering away shot. If the animal is more than 30-35 degrees facing away, you start risking having to put it into the stomach to get the lungs, but then you are shooting such a steep angle you have a high chance of just taking out the one lung. Quartering shots, you should be aiming 5" back of a broadside shot, you'll double lung it, however, you risk hitting the offside sholder, and not getting a pass through shot, and therefore less blood trail.

Of course, it does depend on the degree of quartering away as to how risky a shot it might be. But most of the "where to shoot an elk with an arrow" guides I've ever read say something like the following:

Bow' The quartering away position is less desirable for large animals such as elk Although this angle is excellent for deer, elk are considerably broader in birth and have proportionally larger stomachs In a quartering away position the arrow must pass through a foot or more of intestines and stomach before reaching the vital area. An elk's stomach full of grass and browse can stop an arrow cold.

Quoted From: http://www.nbef.org/elk_java.html

Again, not trying to say I know from experience what I'm talking about - I'm largely regurgatiting stuff I've read elsewhere.

[huntwriter]

The gear which works for deer will also work for elk and moose.
A bow with a draw weight of around 60 to 65lb. is plenty good. Personally I use somewhat heavier arrows then what is fashionable now and cut to the tip broadheads such as Magnus I.
Never had any problems with deer or elk, a friend even got a buffalo on the ground with a similar set up as I have. What is more important than equipment, is proficiency with the bow and being familiar with the game hunted.