Brass. What's the diff?

[T-Man]

So what's the deal with brass.
The last two threads show that people have prefferences for different brands.
I'm using the stuff that I bought and shot (it's Federal mostly...but I have 20 Winchester from a box of power points). Simple reason for using it eh?

What are your prefferences for brass and why?

Does it matter a whole lot to you what brass you reload for, or not much at all?

Just curious,

Trevor

[StoneChaser]

Brass is THE most overlooked factor in accurate handloadsd, and gets careful attention on my loading bench.

Here is my typical routine for brass:

1. Start with ONE lot number of brass for a given rifle
2. Run the necks over the expander ball to iron out the dents
3. Lightly chamfer and debur
4. Run the cases over a neck thickness gauge and discard the uneven necks

I then fireform my brass (be it standard or AI chamber) before getting into "Serious" load work.

After 5 firings I anneal my brass to wring maximum life out of it (25+ firings from my AI brass).

My preference in brass is Winchester due to consistantly concentric necks, tight primer pockets, overall durability, affordability, and availability.

Pay attention to the brass..... inconsistant brass can't yeild consitant results!

StoneChaser

[Downwindtracker]

I'm not that fussy ,but I shoot hunting rifles. Under a MOA,or maybe litttle over.If you weigh brass ,you will find some is more consistant than others,like Federal in 30.06 is only 1%.Other brands weigh less so they are bigger inside. The accuracy types like brass that has neck wall thickness the same all around for even tension on the bullet.Hardness of the brass comes into play as well,Federal for first shot accuracy has soft brass,but for reloading the primer pockes get loose quick.So what,I have a bunch of once fired.

Lapua is what most say is the best.After sorting,and rejecting, the cheapest,too.I'm really impressed with a couple of boxs of 303 Winchester I bought for my P-14,15 reloads now and still going strong! Neck sized but a full hunting load,iron sights are a pain to adjust,you have to buy new front sights.

[Gatehouse]

Of the domestic brass, I liek Winchester thee best, and use it in most of my huting rifles.

Norma an Lapua also make very good brass, for a higher cost.

I weigh brass and usually end up with a stack that looks like this

I
III
II
IIIIIII
IIIIIIIIIIIIII
IIIIIIIIII
IIIIIII
IIII
II

The ones int he middle get selected for most load development, and the outer firnges get stuffed with cheap practice ammo, or just set aside.

[krazy]

Originally Posted by Gatehouse

Of the domestic brass, I liek Winchester thee best, and use it in most of my huting rifles.

Norma an Lapua also make very good brass, for a higher cost.

I weigh brass and usually end up with a stack that looks like this

I
III
II
IIIIIII
IIIIIIIIIIIIII
IIIIIIIIII
IIIIIII
IIII
II

The ones int he middle get selected for most load development, and the outer firnges get stuffed with cheap practice ammo, or just set aside.

I have 50 WW 300 win mag brass that (on avg) weigh 241.2 grains. The Heaviest of the lot weighs 242.4 and the lightest is 237.2. If I remove the lightest (237.2) the next lightest is 240.0. So it is about 2.5 grains from lightest to heaviest with the bulk being around 241ish.

Will a 2.5 grain spread effect accuracy? What is an acceptable range? 1 grain? 2 grains?

I have been loading for a while but have just recently started to look at 'tuning' brass to improve accuracy. Thanks in advance for any info ...

[Downwindtracker]

Gatehouse have you been reading Shakespear "I liek Winchester thee best "

[bushrat]

[quote=krazy]
Will a 2.5 grain spread effect accuracy? What is an acceptable range? 1 grain? 2 grains?
QUOTE]

Depends on how accurate you want to be. In most hunting rifles it generally won't make a greatly noticable difference. In cases as heavy as magnum cases what you have there isn't too bad. I don't bother weighing cases for my hunting guns anymore, haven't found it to make a practical difference. It's unlikely you'll see a difference unless your shooting a gun with a perfect chamber, perfect bore, put together absolutely dead nuts straight, perfect bedding, shooting perfectly balanced and concentric bullets with all the brass tricks like turned necks, fireformed, flash hole uniforming, proven scope, etc. In my benchrest rifle I still sort my brass as to weight with all the tricks done looking for that competitive edge but honestly not seeing an improvement over when I just use random unweighed cases it will still shoot in the .1's. Brass weight may have an effect but it is a small one and unless your shooting a rifle that is capable of winning the supershoot or the nationals your not likely to find a practical difference except for the confidence that everything in the accuracy chain is as good as you can get it. In a competition or when your lining up on a trophy buck that confidence can make all the difference. Put another way, it can't hurt.

[Gatehouse]

Originally Posted by krazy

I have 50 WW 300 win mag brass that (on avg) weigh 241.2 grains. The Heaviest of the lot weighs 242.4 and the lightest is 237.2. If I remove the lightest (237.2) the next lightest is 240.0. So it is about 2.5 grains from lightest to heaviest with the bulk being around 241ish.

Will a 2.5 grain spread effect accuracy? What is an acceptable range? 1 grain? 2 grains?

I have been loading for a while but have just recently started to look at 'tuning' brass to improve accuracy. Thanks in advance for any info ...

If I want best accuracy, I generaly use the brass that is +/- 2 grains.

I debur the flasholes and even up the necks, that is it.

I thik that weighing the cases helps, but frankly, I woud not do it for hunting rifles if I did not have an electronic scale.

[krazy]

Thanks for the replies guys! My rifle is just a hunting rig but i do want it to shoot as accurate as possible so I think I will adopt the +/- 2 grain rule for the brass. I already uniform the primer pockets and debur the flash holes as well as trim to the appropriate length so weighing them should not take that much longer (i do have an electronic scale).

Now what's this about evening up the necks? Are you talking about the inside / outside of the necks or the length? I have an RCBS manual case trimmer for length but if you are talking about neck thickness then perhaps I need a special tool for that? Or can I buy an adapter for my case trimmer? I've gone this far might as well go all the way - lol.

Thanks for the help.

[260_Rem]

I found my 30-06 to shoot 1.5" with Federal Gold Medal brass, and .75" with Lapua brass. Same load - 168 gr TSX over 58 grs H4350

[schmaus]

I've gone this far might as well go all the way - lol.

No sense in only getting to second base

[StoneChaser]

Originally Posted by krazy

Thanks for the replies guys! My rifle is just a hunting rig but i do want it to shoot as accurate as possible so I think I will adopt the +/- 2 grain rule for the brass. I already uniform the primer pockets and debur the flash holes as well as trim to the appropriate length so weighing them should not take that much longer (i do have an electronic scale).

Now what's this about evening up the necks? Are you talking about the inside / outside of the necks or the length? I have an RCBS manual case trimmer for length but if you are talking about neck thickness then perhaps I need a special tool for that? Or can I buy an adapter for my case trimmer? I've gone this far might as well go all the way - lol.

Thanks for the help.

Not to detract from ANYTHING the others have said, but honestly THE best bang for your buck is case neck thickness. If a case is uniform at the neck, the rest of the case is typically uniform also (and vice versa).

Weight will tell you case capacity, but not if you have a lopsided case.

Buy a Sinclair neck thickness gauge (it uses RCBS trimmer pilots) and sort by thickness. Discard the excessive runout (why bother shooting crooked brass) and your case worries will be over.

My two "go to" rifles will shoot HONEST .25-.35" groups all day long with the right load, and CONSISTENTLY after I started checking neck thickness... it seemed to eliminate the gremlin fliers that popped up from time to time to spoil a two shot bug hole and make a 1.5" 3 shot group, just when I had a load "figured" out

Is is necessary for a hunting rifle... no... but a rifle looney needs not justify his sickness

StoneChaser

[Gatehouse]

I'll add one more thing to Stonechasers post..

If I have any trouble whatsoever, I run the brass over my RCBS Case Master guage, and that tells me if the brass is crooked or out of whack.

I agree that a straight seated bullet is important.

[krazy]

Thanks guys I will definatley be buying a case neck gauge of some sort. Is there one gauge that is better than the others (sinclair, rcbs, lyman, etc.) or all they all pretty much the same?

Stonechaser you just throw away the 'crooked' brass? Is it not worth while to use a neck trimmer to true them up?

k

[StoneChaser]

Originally Posted by krazy

Thanks guys I will definatley be buying a case neck gauge of some sort. Is there one gauge that is better than the others (sinclair, rcbs, lyman, etc.) or all they all pretty much the same?

Stonechaser you just throw away the 'crooked' brass? Is it not worth while to use a neck trimmer to true them up?

k

Sinclair makes a superb tool... they're known for their precision.

Yes, I just turf the crooked brass, theory being that crooked necks equate to concentricity issues down the entire brass, and I have have no desire to start neck turning.... life is too short (a fella can polish a turd as much as he likes... but in the end he's still playing with $hit D ).

Buy a bag of 50 Win brass, throw away +/- 10 pieces (usually less) and you'll have super brass at a still very affordable price.

StoneChaser